Event Date: Fall 2025
inFOCUS Quarterly: Tamir, thank you for joining us.
Tamir Murad: Thank you for the opportunity to raise the voice of the Druze – to explain what is happening to our families, literally our families, in Syria. I have family on the other side of the border, the Murad family in Syria.
iF: The Druze have always been an integral part of Israel. There are Druze in Lebanon and there are Druze in Syria as well. Are the Druze citizens in each of those countries?
Murad: Indeed, we are citizens of each of these countries. If there is one thing that we take from our religion, it is that we are loyal to the country we live in. My grandfather joined the IDF before it was mandatory. We asked why. He said, “We are living in the state of Israel. We need to build it together, shoulder to shoulder with the Jewish community.” My other grandfather wasn’t with us for three or four months at a time. We asked why. He had the same answer. “We are here living in the state of Israel. We need to help to build it.” So, he went to the south to work at building the state of Israel.
That’s who we are. You can find us everywhere, doctors, engineers, teachers. We are an integral part of the state of Israel.
iF: Syria is a multi-ethnic country, so do the Druze have communities and partners there?
Murad: Indeed. Before we talk about the Druze in Syria or the Druze in Israel, I want to mention a few things about the Druze community in the world. We are a minority, approximately 2 million people in total. The largest community is in Syria, which is about 1.2 million people. Then you go to Lebanon, Israel, Jordan, and then you can find us in Venezuela, the US, and other countries.
Syria is a unique place. We have to talk about the Druze community before the Arab Spring in 2011 and after. Before 2011, the Druze were an integral part of the Syrian government and the country. After 2011, when Bashar Assad attacked his own people, about 70,000 soldiers didn’t follow him – and the Druze community didn’t follow Assad. A lot of refugees came to Sweida, where the massacre is happening right now, to find shelter. We didn’t ask their religion – there were Sunnis, Muslims, Christians, Alawis. We helped them in Sweida because they were human beings.
iF: The Druze backed away from the government?
Murad: Indeed. We had no intention of hurting civilians.
iF: Since that time, have you been under pressure? Have you been separate from the government?
Murad: I wouldn’t say we were separate from the government; we’re still part of the government. Under the Assad regime, all of the Syrian people were suffering, not only the Druze community.
iF: Then the government changes and dictator Bashar al-Assad fled to Moscow. And now there is a new government. How did the new government approach the Druze initially?
Murad: It’s a good question, but we need to talk about all the minorities. On the outskirts of Damascus is a place called Jaramana. There are about 300,000 people there, the majority are Druze. A minority are Christian. During December, after Abu Mohammad Al-Jolani [Editor’s Note: leader of the formerly al-Qaeda affiliated rebel group Hayat Tahrir al-Sham, real name Ahmad al-Shara’a] came to rule in Damascus, the Christians wanted to celebrate Christmas, so they lit a Christmas tree. Al-Jolani’s people came to Jaramana, to Sahnaya, to burn that Christmas tree. Who stood against Al-Jolani’s people? We, our families, the Druze community. We have been always there for other minorities. We know how minorities feel, that’s why we will never allow someone to hurt others.
They bombed churches. The last church was in Damascus where 80 people were murdered. We didn’t know that we were next as the Druze community in Syria or in Israel. From our side, the Druze community in Israel, our spiritual leader, Sheikh Muwaffaq Tarif sent money with our leaders in Syria to rebuild that church. We didn’t know that we were next.
iF: There were people here who said, “Oh,Al-Shara’a, Al-Jolani, whatever you call him, is just trying to get organized.” It was not well understood. What you’re saying is that it was well understood there, in Syria and in Israel.
Murad: The attacks were against all minorities. They started with the Alawis, they moved to the Christians, they moved to the Yazidis, and then the Druze. They want to finish with the Druze.
Who attacked the minorities in Syria? I can tell you 100 percent. We on the Israeli side, the Druze community, opened an operation room where we collect information and intelligence. All of us are ex-military, each one of us a high commander, and we’re collecting information. And you can see, when people entered Sweida, they were wearing uniforms. After the world saw that, they left Sweida, took the uniforms off, but you see the same faces. So again, to the question, who is attacking the Druze? It’s 100 percent Al-Jolani’s people. They call him “Ahmad al-Shara’a,” and people think when he put on a suit, he became normal. It doesn’t work like that. He still has the same ideology; nothing has changed.
iF: The government was the organizer.
Murad: One hundred percent. We have videos of people in a church, Christians, living side by side in Sweida, next to the Druze community, saying the ones who saved their lives are the Druze community. They went to fight, to help. And they were saying the people who were focusing on us, attacking us, killing us, it was the Jolani people.
iF: Talk, if you can, about outside powers. Turkey, Iran, Russia.
Murad: Turkey is part of NATO. You can see what is tying Israel’s hands in helping the Druze community, is the West and the Americans. But Turkey is a major player in Syria. It supported and trained Hayat Tahrir al-Sham (HTS), which is Al-Jolani’s people, and Jabhat al-Nusra, which has a negative role for our community. We all understand why Turkey has an interest in Syria when it comes to the Kurds. And I heard some sources that the militias, the Bedouin militias, were paid by Turkey – and Qatar – to attack the Druze.
iF: Are the Kurds an ally of the Druze? I realize you’re in different parts of Syria.
Murad: It’s far, but still, we meet with the Kurds; we have the same interests – stability, security, and to live in peace. But, again, since Turkey is part of NATO and it’s a major player, the West is tying the Kurds’ hands. The Kurds have a huge army, some 145,000 soldiers. They can solve the problem in Sweida, but someone is tying their hands.
iF: We’re very clear that the Turks have been attacking the Kurds in northern Syria and southern Turkey for a very long time. I don’t think our government plans to do anything about it.
Murad: Unfortunately, we do understand why the West sees Al-Jolani or Ahmad Al-Shara’a as a partner. During Assad’s time, [Syria was] going with Iran, with Russia and all of the eastern countries, and now he’s giving his hand to the Western countries. But the Druze community has been in the Middle East for thousands of years, since Jethro’s [Editors Note: Moses’ father-in-law] time.
Which I see, unfortunately, is what the West is missing. I’ll give you an example. Europe opened its doors for refugees that came from Syria and now you hear a lot of stories about what’s going on there. The German ambassador to Israel told me, “not all of the refugees are terrorists.” I said that’s true. He said, “90 percent of them are fine, 10 percent are not.” But 10 percent is a huge number. In 2015 alone, during the Syrian civil war, more than one million Middle Eastern refugees, mostly Syrian, moved to Germany.
iF: Enough to be disruptive.
Murad: Indeed.
iF: Israel is engaging in high-level talks with Al-Jolani to find some way to create stability of some sort. I don’t think they want to do it by abandoning the Druze. How do you feel about the Israeli government negotiating with the government of Syria?
Murad: First of all, we are aware of the negotiations. Our spiritual leader has a direct line to everyone here in Israel; we are part of the government. People need to understand that we are everywhere here in Israel. We have a line to everyone.
We understand what the Israeli interest is. You know, if you’re going back before Al-Jolani, the Iranians were here on our borders. My nephew just finished an officer’s course in the IDF. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu was there, and he was on the podium saying that we won’t let anyone touch the Druze community in Syria.
But a couple of months later, we faced a massacre.
Israel attacked Damascus on July 16, but it was after the second wave. We do understand that it’s hard for Israel to attack. Unfortunately, the Western media and Western governments see Al-Jolani as someone that we can talk to. And Israel is following the Western governments now.
Al-Jolani had an opportunity to show the whole world that he was someone else. But he didn’t. At the same time, he’s saying, “It’s hard for me to control the people on the ground in Syria.” But that’s not true. We know it’s his people..
The first wave of attacks on the Druze happened at the end of April and the beginning of May, on the outskirts of Damascus. There were 300,000 Druze living there in Sahnaya and Jaramana. They faced a massacre, they were murdered, raped, and killed, and Israel didn’t do anything. We were mad, but has anything affected our relationship between us and the Jewish community or the state of Israel? No. The relationship is so strong that nothing can change that, basically.
Beyond the Borders
iF: There are people who say Israel can’t be responsible beyond its borders and perhaps the communities outside of Israel, even if they’re important, can’t be Israel’s responsibility. maybe if Al-Jolani is willing to have quiet on the border of Israel, that’s the best Israel can do.
Murad: I think it does make sense. But I want to start with what our PM Netanyahu said recently. “The brothers of my brothers are my brothers.” And if you’re talking about Israel’s interest, we have videos of ISIS people murdering our people; our families in Syria and in Sweida, raping, killing, doing everything, burning people alive, taking video of what they are doing, and they are super proud about that. Not one video, but many.
Yes, they’re laughing. It’s like October 7th. It’s the same twisted kinds of people. So, if anybody understands the Druze position, I dare say it is the government of Israel. When October 7th happened, my brother and I put on our uniforms, and we went to fight. That’s who we are. We went to help our brothers and sisters here in Israel. That’s how we see our families.
The second thing that I would say, is that the attacks happened 62 kilometers from Israel’s border. And getting back to the people that were shooting videos while they were murdering and raping, they were saying, “Now we’re doing this to the Druze community here in Syria. Next, it’s going to be Jerusalem and Tel Aviv.”
So, is it in Israel’s interest?
iF: It’s definitely in Israel’s interest to protect the Druze. But what if you look at your resources and your assets and can’t make your interests and your assets balance?
Murad: I think Israel has enough power to do that.
The Humanitarian Corridor
iF: Talk about the humanitarian corridor, that’s important.
Murad: The humanitarian corridor we’re seeking is from the Druze in Israel to the Druze villages on the Syrian Golan Heights. We Israeli Druze will take humanitarian aid to the Druze in these towns and villages, and they will deliver it to Sweida. It’s from the Druze to the Druze. But it has to be secured.
iF: There was a rumor that there was a US company that does defense security work, operating in cooperation with the US State Department in northern Israel to do that job.
Murad: I met them. They were here, and we took them on a tour inside a Druze town in Syria, which is on the Golan Heights. All of the towns that we spoke about on the Golan Heights are under Israeli protection these days. They met and spoke to everyone –, the US government, Western governments – telling them we should open the humanitarian corridor. But, in the end, they got zero interest.
I work as an advisor to Sheikh Muffawaq Tarik, our spiritual leader in Israel and among all the Druze communities around the world. Last week, we met Ambassador Tom Barrak, the US ambassador to Turkey, in France. He heard from us and saw the videos – everything. He was shocked. He promised to do everything in his power within 24 hours to change the situation in Syria. And, I would say that he did a couple of things. In the first hours, we saw the UN enter Sweida to bring aid. But still, we are stuck without a corridor.
In Sweida, there were 38 occupied villages and towns. More than 230,000 people were displaced. More than 2,000 people were murdered and burned alive. And these are only the numbers that we know at the moment. We think there are still thousands murdered that we don’t know about yet. More than 700 people were kidnapped, 109 of them women. Their kidnappers say, “Maybe if you will get them back, it will be after nine months after they deliver our babies.” They raped a five-year-old child. That’s what’s happening on the ground. And Ambassador Barrak saw all of that.
iF: Are the UN humanitarian people still there?
Murad: Things are very difficult. In Sweida, there were 30 resources for water; 27 of them were destroyed or poisoned. There are more than 800,000 Druze people living there. The Druze community here in Israel is buying things in Damascus from a third party, and we’re delivering them through the Red Cross; flour, milk for kids. There is a siege now in Sweida. They’re saying now there’s a ceasefire, but people are dying of starvation.
iF: What you’re saying is there’s a failure of the international “aid” agencies to provide help. This is what we’ve known about Gaza for a long time.
Murad: You know what’s ironic? We ask them why they aren’t there, and they say, “It isn’t safe in Sweida.” How stupid is that? We ask, “How do you know it’s not safe?” They say, “We ask Al-Jolani’s people, Ahmad Al-Shara’a, whether it’s safe or not.” They’re murdering our people – how can you ask them?
The Poll
iF: There was a poll taken in Syria that said 76 percent of Syrians view Israel as their primary threat, mostly because of Israel’s support for the Kurds and the Druze. Do you think that most Syrians see Israel as the primary threat to their well-being?
Murad: Forty percent of the Syrian population are minorities. They are not Sunnis. And I would say even in the other 60 percent, people are not happy with what Al-Julani is doing. They have been through so much since 2011. I’m telling you, most of the people in Syria seek to have a peace agreement with Israel, to be part of the Abrahamic Accords. And they see and they understand what’s happening to the Druze community. It’s not the correct thing and that’s not how it’s supposed to be.
iF: How do you see the future of the Druze across the region – in Lebanon, which some people are rather optimistic about right now, in Syria, where they’re less optimistic, and in Israel?
Murad: My grandmother came from Syria. She was married to my grandfather in 1947, a few months before the state of Israel. The next time she saw her family was 50 years later. She left when her brother was three years old. She met him for the second time when he was 53 years old. My grandmother passed away less than a year ago. She said she loved this country, but in her heart, she wished she could see her family on a daily basis.
That’s what we wish for.
But we are living in the Middle East. Let’s talk about the near future. First of all, we need to have the siege of Sweida relieved and later we’ll see.
Maybe we can build trust. I don’t know. But if the West sees Al-Jolani as someone it can work with, it is a problem. Everyone understands what’s happening within the Druze community in Syria. No one can say that they don’t understand. The government, not the people. Al-Jolani, Ahmad al-Shara’a, should be made to prove to everyone that he will respect all of the minorities. First, by releasing all of the Druze hostages, then by ending the siege in Sweida, and opening the humanitarian corridor.
iF: Tamir, on behalf of the Jewish Policy Center and the readers of inFOCUS Quarterly, thank you for an important conversation and a great addition to our education.
